I don't understand this.

“Explain how that works if someone was raised from birth with another religious tradition that doesn’t have the Christian concept of salvation, and never heard about it. How is that person “choosing” to go to hell?”

just because you weren’t raised with that reigion doesn’t mean you can’t convert, you can’t HONESTLY say NOBODY has ever heard of christianity. you learn about every religion. so dont pull that. there is one God && he is almighty.

“I am the way, the truth, and the life” john 14:6

“in life you dont get anything that you dont deserve. No the dictator is not fair and just but he is also not God. You cant compare God to a mere man.”

So you’re saying that if a human does something, and your god did the same thing, you would consider one ‘evil’ and the other ‘good’? Why does the actor have any affect on the morality of the act?

Hypothetically, what could your god do that you would consider ‘evil’? And if nothing, then by what standards do you judge him to be ‘good’?

&& I WILL be traveling to africa && other countries where people haven’t heard of the Lord && telling them about it, when I turn 18

Missionaries don’t have a very good track record in many parts of the world, so if you run into some local resistance, hopefully you won’t be surprised.

I have a bible. A teen version, so it’s easier to understand. It offers NO explanation to this question.

Where the Love comes in is God providing a way (a gift/Jesus) not to perish - if desired, check out this verse: John 3 : 16) - He didn’t have to make a way…Take care !!

I spent 12 years of my life in church. I know that verse. And it doesn’t answer my question.

You don’t go to Hell by God’s Choice. If you ask for forgiveness, and Repent your sins, when God comes to call us Home he will take all is Children. Me pesonally, I have faith and do Believe, and when the time comes I will go to Heaven.

God did not tell Adam or Eve or both to take the forbin fruit, they choose to do it. Temption is hard to resist but it is your choice not God’s

“God does not force you to love him. if you choose to be a follower of God, then you will go to heaven. however, if you choose not to follow God, then you will go to hell.”

Suppose I am the absolute dictator of a country. I decree that all those who choose not to bow down to me will be tortured by my secret police. Those who do bow down to me get tax cuts.

Is it my choice to torture them, or theirs to be tortured? Am I “just and merciful”?

Which GOd? The bible talks about 2 believe it or not. Here’s somemore information. Orginally Christains & Jews believed in Many Gods. The supreme God being Yahweh. Out of all the Gods they believed they chose to glorify the most spitful, hateful, malevolient one there is. he doesn’t love everyone. he even declared he hated certain people in the bible Here’s what I don’t get, why didn’t hee just forgive Adam & Eve in the beginning? & Here s something else, he makes us the way we are then punishes us for not being the way he wants us yet he made us, so loving.

“Besides, if you have gone to church for 12 years, shouldn’t you know the answer to this question? “

I’m only 16. Thoe 12 years were from the age of 2 to 14. No one told us kids anything about this. They just said, “If you don’t ask for forgiveness, you’ll go to hell.” And if anyone questioned anything they told us, they wouldn’t explain it.

The god of the Bible is a narcissitic petty tyrant whos also not that bright, rather than a loving father.

If that god is real, everyone is screwed whether they end up in heaven or hell.

God does not send you to hell, you are just without an invitation to heaven. The blood of Christ is your invitation, it is free of charge and no one will be accepted without it.

God does not send you to hell, you are just without an invitation to heaven.

If everyone is hell-bound upon birth in a universe where God is supposedly in control, then he is responsible for their going to hell.

“You don’t go to Hell by God’s Choice.”

Yes you do. Even if you assume it’s a negative choice - that somehow, the default is hell - god is choosing not to ‘save’ you. That seems pretty damn cruel to me.

God does not force you to love him. if you choose to be a follower of God, then you will go to heaven. however, if you choose not to follow God, then you will go to hell. so you see, it’s not Gods choice, it’s ours. we are dooming ourselves to hell. or we can send ourselves to heaven by following God.

Besides, if you have gone to church for 12 years, shouldn’t you know the answer to this question?

God doesnt send you to hell. Youre actions send you to hell. I was taught the doctrine that all you have to do is believe in God. Repentence is more a feeling than the words. Repentence is more like you feeling and knowing that what you were doing is wrong and not doing it again.

Suppose I am the absolute dictator of a country. I decree that all those who choose not to bow down to me will be tortured by my secret police. Those who do bow down to me get tax cuts.

Uh, no sir. He doesnt demand that everyone bow down to him. If you never commit a sin then there is no reason to believe in Jesus. Jesus is salvation. Before Jesus died for our sins anything that we did sent us to hell. Jesus is more like probation if you want to compare it to something. You commit a sin (offense) and he gives you another chance and if you believe (comply to the terms of probation) then you wont go to hell (jail.)

xxgirl I am 17 years old. To me the relationship Jesus and I have is like the relationship that I had with my mother. She used to whip my azz but thats not because she hates me or because she was a be-otch. It was my fault I chose not to do what I knew I was supposed to do. It seems like no one wants to take responsibility for their own actions. You can choose to do whatever you want but yes your actions do cause reactions and your choices have consequences.

When you are a child and you do something wrong you get punished by your parents.

When you are a citizen and you do something wrong you get punished by the government.

When you are a Christian and you do something wrong you get punished by God.

Thats pretty much it you can twist and turn it any way you please but thats as simple as it gets.

The god of the Bible is a narcissitic petty tyrant whos also not that bright, rather than a loving father.

If that god is real, everyone is screwed whether they end up in heaven or hell

dude seems like you got some izzuez!!! ha ha ha

“Uh, no sir. He doesnt demand that everyone bow down to him. If you never commit a sin then there is no reason to believe in Jesus. Jesus is salvation.”

First, most christians believe in ‘original sin’ - that the actions of Adam and Eve have doomed everyone to eternal torment unless they repent, even if they live perfect lives. Nice, huh?

But suppose I amend the scenario: Anyone who commits even a minor offence - jaywalking, say - is required to prostate themselves before me, pledge their undying fealty, and beg for forgiveness, or be tortured mercilessly. Am I now a just, caring dictator?

“I myself will fight against you with an outstretched hand and a mighty arm in anger and fury and great wrath” –Jeremiah 21:5. “If you do what’s right, will you not be accepted?” - Genisis 4:7 “God is not willing that anyone perish but wants every to repent and be saved” - 2 Peter 3:9 “…for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me…”

Yea man he is fair and just and he does care for those that want to be cared for. He fights so hard to be there for us and some fight just as hard to not be loved by Him. The thing about your comparison is that the dictator is just a man. He is not God. He hasnt gone to the extent for us that God has. With God its a give and take relationship where I am sure He gives more to me than I could ever give back. If you killed your only child for a woman (or man) did everything you could for her/him. Saved her/his life a million times. Were responsible for everything good in her/his life and taught him/her every lesson they have learned and he/she constantly spit in your face and showed you no appreciation and recognition how would you feel?

“Yea man he is fair and just and he does care for those that want to be cared for. “

You’re avoiding the question. Is the dictator similarly “fair and just”? What’s the difference?

Your god could easily ‘save’ everyone, but chooses instead to have the vast majority tortured for all eternity. How is that fair or just?

heaven and salvation is a reward to those who deserve it. Do they give 1st place trophies to those who never even entered the race? And about how are they different I SAID: “The thing about your comparison is that the dictator is just a man. He is not God. He hasnt gone to the extent for us that God has. With God its a give and take relationship where I am sure He gives more to me than I could ever give back. If you killed your only child for a woman (or man) did everything you could for her/him. Saved her/his life a million times. Were responsible for everything good in her/his life and taught him/her every lesson they have learned and he/she constantly spit in your face and showed you no appreciation and recognition how would you feel?”

No im not saying that the actor affects the morality of the act. Im saying that the circumstances surrounding the act affects the situation. The proverbial dictator doesn’t deserve worship. The undeserved sense of self-righteousness is what makes the dictator “evil”.

Youre right! My answer is nothing since God is love him doing something evil is virtually impossible. And even though when reading the bible sometimes when he smote someone or something of that nature I was like DAMN thats cold I cant call it evil or judge it at all because God says “For the wisdom of this world is folly with God”. So what I think is so insignificant.

And this is how I judge him to be good. I am stubborn. I had to fall on my face so many times just because I wanted to know learn things for myself rather than just listen and follow blindly. The first time I perused the bible I wasnt just looking for something to believe in. I saw and read and decided that even if God isnt real what the bible says is. The teachings in the bible is how I want to live my life. My mom always told me judge a tree by its fruits. All he talks about is living right and doing right by your fellow man. And loving thy neighbor and not judging people and staying out of people’s business etc. Thats good stuff dude.

And even though when reading the bible sometimes when he smote someone or something of that nature I was like DAMN thats cold I cant call it evil or judge it at all because God says “For the wisdom of this world is folly with God”. So what I think is so insignificant.

How is that not like a dictator? God establishes laws for humanity, like “do not kill” and “don’t be jealous”. But God himself is not required to follow them, and he doesn’t, if you believe the words of the Old Testament. In those ancient stories, God is jealous, genocidal, etc. But we can’t question those actions or call them evil, because God says so. We don’t understand his ways, because we’re mere mortals.

That is dictatorial.

God gave everybody the ablity to make their own decisions. You only go to hell if you choose not to ask for forgiveness. So… he doesn’t send you to hell you send yourself. It’s your choice. God will always forgive your sins if you ASK him to but if you choose a life of sin and decide not to ask for forgiveness than you choose to go to hell.

God gave everybody the ablity to make their own decisions. You only go to hell if you choose not to ask for forgiveness. So… he doesn’t send you to hell you send yourself. It’s your choice. God will always forgive your sins if you ASK him to but if you choose a life of sin and decide not to ask for forgiveness than you choose to go to hell.

God will always forgive your sins if you ASK him to but if you choose a life of sin and decide not to ask for forgiveness than you choose to go to hell.

Explain how that works if someone was raised from birth with another religious tradition that doesn’t have the Christian concept of salvation, and never heard about it. How is that person “choosing” to go to hell?

God doesn’t SEND people to hell. the only way to get to heaven is through him its your choice && clearly atheists dont believe in heaven OR hell so it doesn’t matter to them it only matters to people that believe it. it says in the bible the only way to heaven is through Jesus Christ. && I completely believe that once you ask for forgiveness of your sins your seat in heaven is saved. but you can also get off track && all that like I did but I rededicated my life to God, I didn’t get re-saved just put my life back in God’s hands but still I mean he doesn’t SEND people to hell. like I said, it’s your choice. :)

“God doesn’t SEND people to hell.”

Yeah, and the dictator doesn’t send people to be tortured. His police forces do. But he set the whole thing up.

“you can’t HONESTLY say NOBODY has ever heard of christianity.”

No, but there are lots of people who never heard of christianity - the majority of humans that have ever lived, in fact. What happens to them?

“just because you weren’t raised with that reigion doesn’t mean you can’t convert,”

That’s the typical Christian. “Convert to our religion. Or you’ll go to hell. Because your religion is wrong.” What if someone doesn’t wan to leave their religion? Then do they go to hell for not converting? Please, do tell me.

YOU SHOULD READ THE BIBLE AND ASK A PRIEST OR A PASTOR OR SOMETHING. THEN YOU’LL FIND THE ANSWER. THE TRUTH IS I BELIEVE THAT—GOD GIVES TRIALS TO EVERYONE. HE SENDS CIRCUMSTANCESTO US SO THAT WE COULD CHANGE OUR NEGATIVE MINDS TO POSITIVE ONES. HE SAID AT THE BIBLE THAT “IF YOU DENY ME, I WILL DENY YOU IN FRONT OF MY FATHER.”IT ALSO SAYS THERE THAT WE SHOULDOBEY HIM AND HAVE NO OTHER GODS BEFORE HIM. I MEAN, IF YOU LOVE SOMEONE AND HE OR SHE DOESN’T TRUST YOU OR AGAINST YOU, WOULD YOU STILL NOT DENY HIM? WHAT IF HE HAD DONE EVERYTHING THAT WOULD ACCEPT YOU, DO YOU STILL LOVE HIM? MAYBE THAT’S HOW GOD FEELS IF HE IS DENIED. AND HE DOSN’T WANT HIS GOOD CHILDREN TO BE WITH SOMEONE WHO DOESN’T EVEN LIKE HIM.

“YOU SHOULD READ THE BIBLE AND ASK A PRIEST OR A PASTOR OR SOMETHING. THEN YOU’LL FIND THE ANSWER”

I already said that if I ask people from church, they don’t explain it. Even the pastor.

“HE SAID AT THE BIBLE THAT “IF YOU DENY ME, I WILL DENY YOU IN FRONT OF MY FATHER.””

I didn’t say I deny him. I’m just questioning him and his intentions. What? Is that a sin too?

And you really shouldn’t use caps lock. People might take you seriously. :)

“I MEAN, IF YOU LOVE SOMEONE AND HE OR SHE DOESN’T TRUST YOU OR AGAINST YOU, WOULD YOU STILL NOT DENY HIM? WHAT IF HE HAD DONE EVERYTHING THAT WOULD ACCEPT YOU, DO YOU STILL LOVE HIM? MAYBE THAT’S HOW GOD FEELS IF HE IS DENIED. AND HE DOSN’T WANT HIS GOOD CHILDREN TO BE WITH SOMEONE WHO DOESN’T EVEN LIKE HIM.”

That’s pretty childish from an omnipotent being who refuses to reveal himself to anyone. I’d expect better from teenagers, let alone a god. Not to mention, who responds to being shunned with eternal, unbearable torture? Isn’t that just a little bit out of proportion?

you can’t HONESTLY say NOBODY has ever heard of christianity. you learn about every religion. so dont pull that. there is one God && he is almighty.

Wrong. Even most of your fellow Christians acknowledge that millions of people don’t know about the religion. Not everyone lives in a high-tech, cosmopolitan world like you do where they can study every religion. In places like Turkey, India, and China, there are peasant villages and farms where people never travel further than a mile from their homes. There are isolated tribal societies in places Brazil and Indonesia that have had minimal contact with the outside world. In Afghanistan, which has been in civil war for decades, constant fighting and lack of basic infrastructure prevents many people from sending their children to school. Illiteracy is still prevalent across much of the world, meaning not everyone can read the Bible and study religions.

On top of all that, even if someone has “heard of” Christianity, there is no compelling reason for them to convert, and abandon the religion they were raised with their entire life, especially if they have a negative experience with Christians or missionaries.

It is false and arrogant to assume everyone has heard of Christianity and understands its message well enough to convert, and to assume they would convert. I refer back to my original question: how are these people choosing hell over God?

Have you considered getting a bible that is easy to read, in order to find out these answers for yourself, firsthand? If you go to a Christian bookstore, and ask, they can help you find a bible that is very easy to understand.

Well maybe if you are really plauged by this question you should invest in an adult bible a concordance and a dictionary. The only way to get a direct answer relatively unclouded by biased opinions (not including the translators.

Like I said. The bible doesn’t answer this question. And if it does, you look it up and tell me. Because I can’t find it.

“It is false and arrogant to assume everyone has heard of Christianity…”

that, my friend, is what missionaries are for… && I am one of them. :) && d@mn proud of it thanks. && I WILL be traveling to africa && other countries where people haven’t heard of the Lord && telling them about it, when I turn 18

“that, my friend, is what missionaries are for… “

You still haven’t explained what happens to people who never even hear of christianity, though.

Its so simple girl. The Lord says for God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son so that who ever believes in him shall not perish but have everlasting life. So its like someones dying and you give them the antidote. If they choose not to take it are you killing them? No they are choosing not to save themselves. Simple as that lil mama. God says Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me. He not just gonna force you you have to choose him.

It’s like this: God is so pure goodness that humans perish in front of him. Christians make it sound as if he can’t control this. So really all humans send themselves to Hell for being the way God made them- even though it’s God’s fault and even though he created Hell for it to be that way.

So this is Christianity: God is not love or tolerance, anyone who says this is spreading lies. You are a filthy rag and will perish before God. You will go to Hell for not being perfect in his standards.

The good news is, all sins are equal in God’s eye- If you believe in God, repent, and accept Jesus- all your sins wont count. You will go to Heaven through God’s love & mercy of not sending you where you belong, to Hell.

You see, Jesus didn’t have to die for you, he could have been an asshole about it. If you believe in him, we wont send ourselves to burn in Hell- where God mandates we deserve to be.