Question For Christendom:
Why do you try so hard to deny that many or your key doctrines and celebrations are so steeped in paganism that the first-century Christians didn't even adhere to them. Many of Christendom's ways of thinking are heavily influenced by pagan ideology, by Hellenistic philosophy, and by whatever political opinion happens to be trendy for whatever time-period it happens to be in.
Why Can't Chrisendom Just Come Clean And Stop Giving The Bible & Christ A Bad Name? (You Are Actually Bringing Reproach Upon The Almighty Himself Through Your Bad Conduct & Many Sincere Individuals Are Mislead From What The Bible Actually Teaches),
P.S.-Whenever I hear an explanation for any of the pagan festivities, customs, and beliefs, they are always tainted by dishonesty or down-played which are not becoming traits of those who would profess to be followers of Christ.
If you truly believe in what the bible says then you know that what would be know as Christianity didn't just spring up at the birth of Christ. Jesus was God in the flesh and God has been around forever ... In the bible it talks about prophecy of a saviors birth LONG before he came around; Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counselor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." (sounds familiar don't it?). Well Isaiah wrote Isaiah (did ya see that one coming ? ) and he lived almost 800 years before the birth of Jesus. That is just the easy to find and most well known prophecy about the coming of Jesus.
It's easier (and correct) to believe that somehow pagan beliefs came from Christianity (before it was called that). I'm not going to try to get in an argument here because I don't have the time or the energy to make someone see what they don't want to. God is God and has always been ... he doesn't need people to believe that he is to be (though he REALLY wants you to). So to sum it up, if you want to debate weather God was/is or not then you can't see what I'm talking about; since God was here first he was the originator of all things so paganism came from someone adopting and changing his ideas.
there are those of us christians out there that dont deny many of our holidays to be pagan in orientation. the days of the week are pagan names! we are surrounded with symbolization that is pagan in origin. it is part of our culture, and will always be. I dont have a problem with it. and many of us are not as closed minded as the majority. I love my God and Jesus, but I also love my husband and he is pagan! We have a respect for eachother and our right to choose our own way of belief. My husband is the most honest, decent, respectful man I have ever met, even of all the men I met in the christian community! my mother who is a deconess in her church loves him dearly! I dont know if I will spend my forever with my husband, or where he will be in the next life...only God knows, but we have determined to make our life here, today, the best we can together. he and I both are better people for loving eachother, and not all christians get on a soap box preaching hell and damnation to the masses!
Amblessed: "Christians aren't perfect, but they are saved from damnation having been bought with a price - by Jesus Christ on the cross at Calvary."
Orion: WOW! You really hate Christians don't you! Do you hate God too?
Two of the biggest zealots on here, and neither answers a very legitimate question. They only offer dogma, and emotional outbursts.
I challenge either of you to explain why so many christian doctrines, holidays, and rituals are so similar to pagan ones.
Do you deny that concepts such as a virgin birth, gods born to mortal women, god eating rituals (communion), baptism, and the resurection all predate the birth of christ? There are many more. Dionysus even turned water into wine. There is nothing really original about christianity.
So please tell me, is it just coincidence that all of this well known pagan dogma actually then came true with the birth of christ? Or was it an old fable that was simply recycled?
With respect to your comments regarding Chrisendom: if you've done any amount of research into the socio-theological developments of Judaism from the Second Temple period up to the time of Paul, you would (quickly) find that such developments arose because of interaction (and influence) from pagan ideology, Hellenistic philosophy, and political agendas of the time. (This is not to say that Jewish-Christianity is those things; it is simply pointing out the fact that Jewish-Christianity was keenly aware of such things and adapted them to varying degrees for its own purposes). So in criticizing the methodology of Chrisendom, you are laying the same criticisms against the methodology used by many of the writers of several key biblical texts.
I am not just talking about the holidays. I could understand if it was only things like the dates of holidays or the easter bunny and eggs that were adopted from pagan days, but I am talking about the core tenets of christianity. Baptism, communion, the virgin birth, the resurrection. All of these things existed before the birth of christ in pagan religions.
Are there no true believers who will take this one on?
I would also like to see a legitimate response. this is a question that I have wondered about and I would love to see it addressed here. please stop with the preaching and answer the question.
maybe amblessed could take this one...
orion is just too angry and judgmental.
At least we haven't started building giant wicker men and filling them with prisoners and setting fire to them yet. . . . You must be familier with the catholic church. . . Don't judge us all by the catholic traditions. . . .
I'm curious on what basis you've arrived at the doctrines and celebrations of 1st century Christians. Virtually nothing is known about early Christians
Christians aren't perfect, but they are saved from damnation having been bought with a price - by Jesus Christ on the cross at Calvary.
orion, he didn't say he hated Christians. Accusations won't help the matter, please keep it civil.
Get over it, We have to do something while the pagans are doing there thing, thus the holidays :)
rnealw: No, the crusades and the inquisition were much more humane than that, I'm sure.
WOW! You really hate Christians don't you!
Do you hate God too?