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Why is, even tho they say we all have freedom of speech, does everyone object when I quote the Bible? I mean, if others quote other sources it's okay...ie:marilyn monroe, but if I quote the living God I'm not allowed--is this fair?
Please do not tell me that you think Lincoln was one of the founders of this country? You, my dear, are wrong in your statement regarding this country being founded on Christ.
The United States became one of the first countries in the world to enact freedom of religion by way of a separation of church and state.
The framers of the United States Constitution rejected any religious test for office, and the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution specifically denied the central government any power to enact any law respecting either an establishment of religion, or prohibiting its free exercise.
Quote from Jefferson "History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance, of which their political as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purpose." --- Thomas Jefferson to Baron von Humboldt, 1813
Quote from Benjamin Franklin "I wish it (Christianity) were more productive of good works ... I mean real good works ... not holy-day keeping, sermon-hearing ... or making long prayers, filled with flatteries and compliments despised by wise men, and much less capable of pleasing the Deity."--- Benjamin Franklin, Works, Vol. VII, p. 75
Quote from John Adams "I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved--the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced!" --- John Adams, letter to Thomas Jefferson
Quote from Thomas Paine Here it is that the religion of Deism is superior to the Christian Religion. It is free from all those invented and torturing articles that shock our reason or injure our humanity, and with which the Christian religion abounds. Its creed is pure, and sublimely simple. It believes in God, and there it rests.
Quote from James Madison "What influence, in fact, have ecclesiastical establishments had on society? In some instances they have been seen to erect a spiritual tyranny on the ruins of the civil authority; on many instances they have been seen upholding the thrones of political tyranny; in no instance have they been the guardians of the liberties of the people. Rulers who wish to subvert the public liberty may have found an established clergy convenient auxiliaries. A just government, instituted to secure and perpetuate it, needs them not." --- James Madison, "A Memorial and Remonstrance", 1785
About George Washington The name of Jesus Christ is NOT mentioned even once in the vast collection of Washington's published letters. He refers to Providence in numerous letters, but he used the term as a synonym for Destiny or Fate. Bishop White, who knew him well for many years, wrote after Washington's death that he had never heard him express an opinion on any religious subject. He added that although Washington was "serious and attentive" in church, he never saw him kneel in prayer.
And why in the world would I ask to hear the "word" from someone who carries and voices such obvious disdain for non-christians, who doesn't understand the very basis for the founding of our country and who spells cousin, "cuzn".
I am jewish and WOULD NEVER ask for the word from someone so narrow-minded. What a great witness! Give the "word" to someone else. You have already shown me your example of the "word" and you typed it in ALL CAPITALS!
And as for Lincoln, though not a founder of this country as you indicate: Abraham Lincoln's religious beliefs are a matter of controversy. Lincoln frequently referenced God and quoted the Bible, yet never joined any church. He was particularly secretive about his beliefs and respected the beliefs of others.
Oh No, better leave him off your list. Lincoln RESPECTED the beliefs of others.
Well... this is going to take a while...
cracks knuckles . . .
our rights, that we lost, well lets see, you cant have prayer at a graduation wit out someone turining the mic off
That's because people have gotten smart enough to realize that possibly not ALL the people attending the graduation is CHRISTIAN. They could either omit all religious rituals, or include some ritual/prayer/whatever from EVERY religion attending. Which one would be easier, hmm?
foreigners get upset bout the pledge and they change it just for them
...you mean IMMIGRANTS? Well... again, people got smart... and realized this isn't a Christian country. They could either omit all religious references, or reference ALL religions. Once again, which one would be easier, hmmm?
you cant have a home school GRADUATION in a church b/c people gets offended, its a gradutaion NOT church service, you cant pray at games,
I've already addressed this issue... look up...
you cant quote the Bible anywhere
WRONG. Don't combine 'overzealous' with 'drama queen' ...that might cause a rift in the space/time continuum.
they took off under God on pepsi cans
Maybe God told them to take it off, because it was pointless to put his name on a product nobody buys?
you cant witness in the nursing homes or visit people in the hospital
Funny... I was at a hospital YESTERDAY, and there was a IN HOUSE chaplin there. What is HE there for?
when it comes to money, the government takes churches
Uhhh... churches are tax-exempt...
we cant have a stand against any sin without people bein offended
There's that 'drama queen' thing again... careful...
but its ok for gays to have a parade and be nude...
Being gay isn't a crime, public nudity IS, so If you want to have a Christian Nudist parade... I'll go...
its ok for them to show sex on tv but we cant stand on the street corner and preach and teach God's love...
Well, there's plenty of PREACHING on TV, and in some cities, there's sex on street corners... even swap.
he came and died and took shame for you people
I noticed you didn't include yourself in that... strange. ONCE AGAIN... you BELIEVE that... talking about your FAITH as matter of fact, only proves your ignorance, and both defies & misrepresents the God you're trying so awkwardly to defend.
and all you can do is complain bout people who is trying to help you..
That's your problem, regarding matters of faith... you SUCK at helping people.
why should I worry bout them?
You shouldn't... you're in no position to help people, because you don't know enough about your own faith, to be of help to anybody. You need to fix YOU first... you've got issues...
Ladies and Gents, we have a winner for longest run-on sentence...
"and we have the right to tell you why you are wrong for objecting the statement, if there is no pfreedom of speech on here and we cant quote the Bible on here then why a\have a religious sections and yes I know there are others on here, but once again if htey can quote whatever then we can quote the Bible, people coming on here and sayin we can mock and whatever...how can you say that, we dont have a chance to say anything so you can, but if I was another domination or believed in the manin the moon, I can quote whatever they say...thats the thing, its not whether or not you mock or whatever, its bein able to say bout God's love, wats wrong wit someon sayin God loves you, it says it right here in John 3:16, that offends people but if some buddah person said something its ok...no it isn...im not sayin they cant talk or whatever, but they should have the same restrictions that Chrisitian people do...this country )US) was found on Christ and now the government wants to do away wit Him...they need to get right and if they dont, id hate to be them when they come face to face wit God"
Take a breath and THINK about what you are trying to say, it might help.
This country was NOT founded on Christ. and you think the government wants to do away with Christ? No One stands a chance of being elected president unless they are christian.
I grow so terribly weary of many of the christians crying about lost rights. EXACTLY what rights have you lost?
I think some people needs to get over how others type that has nothing to do wit the question...stay on topic, youre the one cryin on how we type you dont like they way I type DONT READ IT THEN, I DONT CARE what YOU THINK BOUTMY TYPING, I WILL TYPE THE WAY I WANT...anyways, our rights, that we lost, well lets see, you cant have prayer at a graduation wit out someone turinin the mic off, foreigners get upset bout the pledge and they change it just for them, you cant have a home school GRADUATION in a church b/c people gets offended, its a gradutaion NOT church service, you cant pray at games, you cant quote the Bible anywhere, they took off under God on pepsi cans (that are patriotic and has the pladege on it), you cant witness in the nursing homes or visit people in the hospital, when it comes to money, the government takes churches, we cant have a stand against any sin without people bein offended but its ok for gays to have a parade and be nude...its ok for them to show sex on tv but we cant stand on the street corner and preach and teach God's love...hows that, is that good enough for you?...and its gettin worse, it shows on this website that its getting worse by people's attitude toward God, he came and died and took shame for you people and all you can do is complain bout people who is trying to help you...im no longer sittin here and wonder how I can say things to not to offend people, they dont care to offend and insult me, so why should I worry bout them?
I am not going to get into the argument over rights, because I think that all sides of the argument have been adequately covered already. If you want to know, I think that Christians are often criticized more than other religions (except maybe Islam) but that others have the full right to do so. However, what I wanted to reply to was your comment that "this country was NOT founded on Christ".
I disagree with you. What lish54 was trying to say, albeit inarticulately, was that the founders of America were Christians and based the country's constitution off of their beliefs. The original settlers of the USA were largely Europeans who came here for the freedom to practice there different styles of Christianity in peace. Their descendants, also largely Christians, were the people who wrote America's constitution. As a result, America's basic laws were based off of Christian morals. The founding fathers open faith is obvious in the national motto, "in God we trust".
So while America today may not be extremely Christian in its populace or policies, that is where its roots are.
and we have the right to tell you why you are wrong for objecting the statement, if there is no pfreedom of speech on here and we cant quote the Bible on here then why a\have a religious sections and yes I know there are others on here, but once again if htey can quote whatever then we can quote the Bible, people coming on here and sayin we can mock and whatever...how can you say that, we dont have a chance to say anything so you can, but if I was another domination or believed in the manin the moon, I can quote whatever they say...thats the thing, its not whether or not you mock or whatever, its bein able to say bout God's love, wats wrong wit someon sayin God loves you, it says it right here in John 3:16, that offends people but if some buddah person said something its ok...no it isn...im not sayin they cant talk or whatever, but they should have the same restrictions that Chrisitian people do...this country )US) was found on Christ and now the government wants to do away wit Him...they need to get right and if they dont, id hate to be them when they come face to face wit God
ACTUALLY I TYPED IN ALL CAPS SO I COULD SCROLL DOWN TO READ WHEN SOMEONE WENT OFF LIKE you JUST DID... :) AND YES, I CONSIDER ALL OF OUR FOREFATHER'S OPINIONS AND TOLERANCES WHEN I LOOK AT OUR COUNTRY--CHRISTIANITY WAS DERIVED FROM THE JEWS, SO I RESPECT YOUR BELIEF MORE THAN you COULD EVEN UNDERSTAND...AND AS FOR THE QUOTES YOU GAVE--THEY WERE CLEARLY DIVIDING CHURCH AND STATE B/C OF PAST ABUSES OF POWER BY THE CHURCHES IN ENGLAND AND ROME...THERE IS A CLEAR DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A "RELIGIOUS PERSON" AND A TRUE CHRISTIAN--ONE WHO HAS A RELATIONSHIP WITH AND TRIES TO BECOME MORE LIKE CHRIST...I AM NOT HERE TO ARGUE OR "CUT DOWN" OTHERS, AND I USE LOTS OF WORDS THAT YOU MIGHT OBJECT TO--BUT HE IS STILL MY FAVE CUZN... :) PS--HE USED TO BE GAY TOO...GOD DELIVERED HIM...WITH GOD ALL THINGS ARE POSSIBLE...
...and we have the right to tell you why you are wrong for objecting the statement...
RIGHT. Everybody gets to object to what they want, on both sides... a.k.a. freedom of speech. So why was this subject even brought up?
**if there is no pfreedom of speech on here and we cant quote the Bible on here **
...you... JUST established that there IS freedom of speech here. Maybe you should slow down and THINK about what you're ranting over.
**this country )US) was found on Christ **
WRONG
the government wants to do away wit Him...they need to get right and if they dont, id hate to be them when they come face to face wit God
Congrats... you're officially a 'religion abuser' (a.k.a. the REASON why Christians are so divided, and have such a bad reputation) ...and an idiot...
People have an opinion on everything and they are going to tell you what their opinion is. As backbyter and ichibanarky said if you're just stating your opinion then that's fine but as soon as you start pushing your beliefs then you ask for whatever you get (not that you do that).
However some people no matter what you say will always try to discredit you and your beliefs. Don't let them bother you. You have every right to believe what you want, just like they also do.
They will tell you that there is no proof of God and then give you all kinds of facts to state this when in actuality no body can prove if God exists or doesn't exist. Believe what you want, and don't worry about what others say of your opinion.
Good luck
lish54: You never had the right to have payers at state events, or have state events in religious places. You're always welcome to pray in private or with other like minded people. You don't have the right - and have never had the right - to impose your religion on others.
"when it comes to money, the government takes churches"
'takes' churches? Do you mean 'taxes'? Because churches are tax-free.
"ok for them to show sex on tv but we cant stand on the street corner and preach and teach God's love"
Sure you can - you're just not immune from the (non-violent) responses of people who dislike what you're saying.
I don't think God wants us to debate what we believe in. It's more about spreading the Gospel if you feel that' s your calling. Knowing He is with you throughout your spiritual journey.
Yet, as you can see people will speak out and that comes with the territory. I just think don't take it personal it's not against you anymore it's more of a problem to people because of whot/what you believe in. In the long run we'll see or not, the fruit of the seed that we plant. Keep strong and stick to what you believe in. I like to think I respect others beliefs, therefore, I can only ask for the same in return. God bless.
no it isn fair, I know what you mean, nobody wants to offend the sinners but its ok if us christians get offended by it...there is no such thing as a freedom of speech..if there was ALL religions could say what they want, and we could quote what the Bible says, also people dont want to hear b/c if they do their afraid God will get a hold of them and they'll see that they are wrong and they'll have to change or deal with God...its not only you that gets rejected by it, I have to, the non believers say they have a right to say, well so do I...
utopia pretty conclusively showed your original claim - that the US was "founded on christ" to be false. Why that's the case is pretty much irrelevant. I'd also like to join with him in saying: You thought lincoln was a founder? That doesn't lend you much credibility.
And you're typing your entire message in capitals because it makes it slightly easier for you to find it? It makes it a lot harder for all of us to read it. Learn to use the search function and you can stop looking like an idiot.
Why is, even tho they say we all have freedom of speech, does everyone object when I quote the Bible?
You have the freedom to quote the Bible, and other people have the freedom to object to it. Their objection isn't preventing you from doing so.
I mean, if others quote other sources it's okay...ie:marilyn monroe, but if I quote the living God I'm not allowed--is this fair?
Exactly WHERE is this issue occuring? Where are you not allowed to quote the Bible?
ACTUALLY, you ARE WRONG--THIS COUNTRY WAS FOUNDED ON CHRIST--READ GEORGE WASHINGTON'S, THOMAS JEFFERSON, OR LINCOLN'S DIARIES--YOU WILL FIND THEY NOT ONLY MENTION GOD, BUT ALSO SPECIFY WHO--JESUS CHRIST. I HAVE A CUZN THAT USED TO TALK DOWN ON CHRISTIANS LIKE SOME OF YOU, AND NOW HE IS ONE...I PRAY THE SAME FOR ALL OF YOU...NO ARGUMENTS HERE--I CAN ONLY GIVE you THE WORD WHEN you ASK ME FOR IT ON HERE...THAT IS A RULE :) ASK THE DUDE.---
Nobody's stopping you from quoting the bible - they're just exercising their right to free speech to object when you do.
It's worth pointing out, though, that this is a private site. None of our rights to free speech apply here, as we're here at the invitation of the site owners. If they want to stop you from saying something, they're perfectly entitled to: Free speech doesn't mean people are required to provide you with a platform.
This makes me so sad. I am a Christian, but the "religious" people that I see on forums like this and on tv often make me ashamed to be under the same label as them. If they looked at the Bible, they would see that Jesus is extremely intelligent, but was able to tell others His message in a way that was loving and non-offensive He also never forced his opinions on people. He probably didn't have horrible grammar either :)
I second backbyter.
To quote is one thing, to use it as an advantage towards preaching for the purpose of religious conversion is despicable.
As much as you have a right to your religion - I have a right to mine, and I don't appreciate people telling me that I'm wrong in my belief.
No it isn't fair, but it matters not - "This is easy explained by the Holy Scriptures. If they hated me, then they will hate you also, Jesus said." - just strive to do and say what pleases Him and fight the good fight ! - what indescrible joy it will be to hear Him say "Well Done" !!
You know what, the Bible teaches us to spread the word of Gospel and not to be ashamed of it, so you know what I say? Kiss my God loving feet, when people look at me strange when I quote the Bible. Its no-ones business what you think or say,so love it up!!! God Bless!!
You want to suppress the same freedom of speech that allows you to quote the bible? If you have the right to quote the bible, people have the right to complain...
lol... sorry its just funny... this would be so much more entertaining if the religious zealots were more intelligent (or is that a contradiction in terms?)
I don't think God wants us to debate what we believe in I agree he'd rather we be ignorant ...o wait that would be the church
You are free to quote the Bible, and I am free to mock you for doing so. That's what freedom of speech is all about..
agreed you have the right do do so and we have the right to object to that statment.
They don't ALL act that way. But the ones that do... are more memorable...
I can feel the respect...
