Last question reguarding abortion.

Ok one last question when is it considered an actual living human being? Because it starts its life with all the information needed to become a human and just isnt fully grown. There is only an incubation period where it recieves nourishment from the...

mother. So once it is born is it then considered a human being? After all inside of the mother it is preparing for everything outside. So we have just established that a fetus is no different then an infant. It is possible for them to survive out side the womb 2 months after conception. The next locial conclusion that you would come up with is when it transends that of an ordinary animal. But the time it actually becomes what we could considered a fully functional human being is around the age of 5 when it is able to demonstraight inductive reasoning. So then What is the difference between killing a fetus and killing a 4 year old?
Answers to your questions
Based on your straw man theory I would then have to go and fornicate every waking moment with every women I see. The difference is I am useing a condom to prevent life, that is not killing life.
Many of you have failed to answer the question and in defence try to justify your inability to answer buy concluding that had the woman not had an abortion that child would not have lived anyway.
Lets assume that you are right and abortion is painless to the child even though the child does move to avoid the suction. What about when the body is out of the mother they jam sissors into the back of the babys neck to suck. how is that not painful? Is it really that easy for you to justify killing because a child would be inconveinent?

If killing life is the question... we seem to have no problem killing the bacteria on the kitchen counter top, squashing the spider in the shower drain, slaughtering the cow for our beef, shoes etc.

So why then is killing *this* life so important? Because it is potentially a human life ? (yes, we ARE that arrogant of a species.) Then when little Johnny and Katie want to have sex and decide not to... they are killing the potential for a human life. Even the act of a man tossing his semen away... it had a potential too.

Adoption is a much better way to go. Sure, 119,000 children are waiting to be adopted in the foster care system alone. Ask your favorite anti-abortion protester if they plan on adopting.

No one would be having this argument if these woman who want an abortion had the proper education to prevent an unwanted pregnancy and the proper resources (finances?) to prevent it.

I don't think abortion is a very good solution. I'm not against it, nor am I for it.
I'm about preventing it in the first place. If people put as much effort into preventing abortion instead of arguing whether it's wrong or not... we would have A LOT fewer abortions.

xox
Sika

ok, I kinda lost you on all the long story stuff...our we still on the same question?LOL 'cause you asked like 3 more and I didn't even get passed the first one!!!...b-sides, you look like u've got the answer down packed 2 me?

Where the heck were you earlier? People are going to still disagree and that is fine. but enought with the evil answers. about you are wrong and keep your mouth shut and blah blah blah. really nice to hear a males point of view, because in all of this no one even thought about if the dad should have any rights. I feel they should have a say. And it is nice to hear you say that you are takin care of your business. Way to go.

And to the people who disagree with me I am sorry, but I feel that I had to say that even if it could save one life.
First they came for the jews, I was not jewish so I did not speak.
Second they came for the communist, I wasnt communist so I didnt speak.
Third they came for the union workers, I wasnt a union worker so I didnt speak.
Then they came for me and there was no one to speak for me.

Begins at Conception - the baby just outside the mothers body, then sissors jammed in, the same as you or I - the pain has to be undescribable !!

Once conception has taken place it is baby. I have seen abortions of all ages of the baby. Trust me they know it and can feel it. That is why MN passed a law stating anytime an abortion is done the baby must be given pain medicine. A good website to visit is http://www.afa.net

Good Luck.

well there are 2 sides of abortion
there is pro life
they believe that life beging at conception
[when sperm meets the egg]
and that women should kill the baby
they consider it murder

then there is prochoice
they believe that a woman has the right to decide what to do with her body
but just because you are pro choice
that doesnt mean pro abortion
they believe that life begins when the baby is able to live outside the womb

well there are 2 sides of abortion
there is pro life
they believe that life beging at conception
[when sperm meets the egg]
and that women should kill the baby
they consider it murder

then there is prochoice
they believe that a woman has the right to decide what to do with her body
but just because you are pro choice
that doesnt mean pro abortion
they believe that life begins when the baby is able to live outside the womb

tseirpeht
AMEN!!! Doesnt matter the stage of preg. Its a baby!!! If it isnt a baby, you were never pregnant!!!

***So we have just established that a fetus is no different then an infant.***

No... we haven't...

***It is possible for them to survive out side the womb 2 months after conception.***

Really? How? In a test tube? That's not survival... that's a science experiment. So... what are the qualifications that make a living, breathing organism? Well, it have to be alive... yes... and it has to be breathing too, right? Well... fetuses don't breathe...

***The difference is I am useing a condom to prevent life, that is not killing life.***

So... you're saying that sperm and ova cells aren't alive?

Really great Question!! Rhetorical - but what a great question.

It is considered a living human being once it is *viable* outside the uterus- that means, breathing, thinking, functioning.

I have seen abortions of all ages of the baby. Trust me they know it and can feel it.

People often argue that has a heartbeat, and apparently has 'brainwaves' as little as 40 days after conception, so it's human, and you therefore, are wrong in terminating. While the heartbeat bit is true, the brainwaves bit is not. That idea came from some research done in the sixties which has since been debunked. The measurement of brainwaves involves using Electroencephalography (EEG), which measures electrical potential over two bipoles (separated charges). In order to do that, the cortex needs to have axons, dendrons, neurons and synapses between. This does not happen until between 20-24 weeks along, way after the first trimester, which is when most terminations are performed. This means any electrical activity in the cortex before then is not 'thought', it is random firing in the brain, almost like a test done by the body to make sure construction is going to plan. And because of this revelation, while nerves/pain receptors develop (at the *very* earliest) at 8 weeks, but without a functioning brain, this is irrelevant, as pain and pleasure cannot distinguish themselves without a functioning cortex. There have been research papers and books published on this, I encourage you all to look them up, particularly one called Pain and its effects in the human neonate fetus.

It's when it is a late term abortion (when the foetus is viable outside the uterus) that terminating is wrong. I agree, that *is* murder.

but just because you are pro choice, that doesnt mean pro abortion

Very true! It merely means you recognise it's not your choice to make what happens to another person's body.

while the heartbeat bit is true... so then stopping a beating heart , to me , is taking a life. but as a man I really don't think I'll ever need an abortion, so maybe this one should be left to the women to decide...NOTHING else comes close to this issue when and comes to church and state, certain religions will say life begins at conception ( which, even science proves that to me anyway , as soon as a womans body starts to prepare and build another life, there are two beings there, not one.) people of different faiths have different opinions on this subject, so I guess man, posing as lawmakers, has tried to make an even playing field, making the laws the same for everyone concerning abortion in this country where other countries have different laws concerning this...were they wrong to do this? well to some yes, and to others, no...you stated this was YOUR last question concerning this , but this question will be asked forever...

It is a human sperm and a human egg that combine and become human life. We are thinking cognizant human beings with deductive reasoning. I also believe we have a soul that is tied to a life after this world. Terminating the fetus of this life is wrong.

Abortion is obviously acceptable to some, but even if my view is scewed, this crap about it is the woman's right to choose is so egocentric and self centered. What rights do the father have, and those who hold my opiniion, what right have you offered the fetus??

A spider feels pain when we kill them too. The bleach you just poured on the floor murdered tons of bacteria.
Cells can get stressed which sometimes we interpret as pain because they flinch and squirm.

I just hate how biased everyone is when they talk about life. If it doesn't have the potential to be a human life, it's inconsequential.

Prevention.

xox
Sika

sikashimmer I appreciate your views. However, I have been a student of nature for over 5 decades. One animal eats another to survive. It will be a parasite or a sucophant of live animals, or kill them to survive.. It literally is an eat or be eaten world.

In your world if it doesn't have the potential to be a human life, it is inconsequential? Yes inconsequential to the life form above it.

Lions eat gazelles. Hyennas steal food and eat living flesh. Elephants and Giraffes eat living plant life. Humans eat wheat a product of a living plant. At what point do we stop considering life for our sustenance?

I certainly do not support nor endorse the torture nor abuse of animals. But I do not belive the human race should not starve to death or die to preserve life.

*** what right have you offered the fetus??***

None... because by law they aren't considered a human...

captainassassin

Because by law they aren't considered a human,

Are we to accept that life doesn't begin at conception? The Law has changed so much just during my lifetime. We continually change our attitudes and acceptance of The Law.

We have argued about the 'right to life' of an adult human. Would we save a human because they are just that--human. Yes we would.

Yet, would we save a human fetus over that of a bacteria, or a tapeworm? I'd hope so, because it is human.

Human life begins at conception. When a human sperm fertilizes a human egg. it becomes human life. Just as a dog's sperm fertilizes a dog's egg. It becomes a dog's life.

Do you consider human life more important than other life on earth?

I would hope so.

All the information needed for any given person exists *before* conception as well. It's only because you think some magic soul thingy gets involved at conception that you give special consideration to a newly fertilized egg that you don't give to the sperm and egg that went into 1 second prior to fertilization.

Life began long before conception, yet none of us value the sperm and eggs that go into a conceptus.

Are we to accept that life doesn't begin at conception?

Conception involves the cellular process of meiosis- the replicating of cells. Cells in our bodies also replicate to repair themselves. Are you going to call murder on every cell of epidermis you shed daily?

and thats why I love Massachussetts... vote to save the greyhounds and kill our babies...frikn awesome...dopey dems