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Good point! Though by my understanding of the law... it is even more insidious than that. Those who are deemed by the government to be able to procure health insurance must provide proof of coverage or they are forced to pay their "Danegeld"... what the SCOTUS chooses to label an excise tax. Without having working access to an individuals finances... that seems like an awfully arbitrary rule to impose. So... perhaps a person deemed wealthy enough to buy insurance thinks it better to forego the insurance in order to pay for further schooling or to finance a small business... so that in the future when the likelihood is greater that they will need insurance... they would be better situated to afford it. The so called excise tax is not exchanged for the individual's insurance procurement... it is collected as any other individual tax... to be used as 100% of our income taxes are... to finance the interest on our national debt. So some people will be forced to buy the car in your example by paying the equivalent in excise tax... but they'll still be hitching rides. Though you do make a good point...per your example...what if someone lived on a lake and thought it more prudent for themselves to buy a boat? The money paid out for the insurance policy might better be spent seeking alternative healthcare... depending upon the individual. That decision should be left to the individual. Who is to say that the standards set in the bill for the requirement remain where they are? If the Insurance and pharmaceutical companies who wrote the bill wish to shake even more citizens down for loose change... they can just lobby the congress to lower the regulations. Off topic but prudent is the fact that Justice Kagan had no business offering an opinion as she helped codify the bill in the first place as solicitor general under Obama. http://funadvice.com/r/bt3uegnm7sc She should have recused herself and by all rights her opinion should be thrown out. That's not going to happen. We are living in a banana republic now. The indoctrinated youth here are cheering as the chains that bind them are being clasped around their ankles. They will champion any draconian measure if their teachers tell them doing so makes them good Americans or humanitarians. The bell curve has one helluva steep incline to overcome... unfortunately.
I think that a social security system where you are obliged to have some sort of insurance that will pay medically necessary expenses is good.
No one should be without medical care if they need it.
Whether or not the system planned in the US is good, I cannot tell. I do not know about it.
The UK have a completely publicly finances helath system. I think that is good. Everyone can go to the doctor there if they need to.
Germany has a mixed public-private financed health system. Everyone is obliged to have insurance. But most people are in public insurance which is basically equal to tax-financed health system. If you want extras (like, for example, guaranteed single-bed-rooms in hospital) and you can afford it, you can get private insurance.
I think that nobody should be forced to make contracts with a private insurance companies for health insurance. But I believe that having some social security system is necessary.
There were ways to provide health care that would have been much more equitable rather than to force the people who would rather pursue their own course for healthcare to buy into the insurance policies. This bill is solely about filling the coffers of insurance companies... have no doubt... Follow the money trail... http://funadvice.com/r/163hvh81dsb
It is obvious now that the country has descended into a post constitutional fascist state. Corporations control the congress and the courts. The fascist state now has precedent to shake down their subjects as long as the booty collected is referred to as a tax. Self determination is a right held only by a sovereign citizen... When we can no longer determine our best interest... when we are beholden to the fascist state to make those determinations for us... we are serfs. Those applauding this ruling are bleating sheep... in line behind the judas goats... awaiting their fleecing.
I don't know what to think. They always make these programs so hard to comprehend. I'm for the idea of everyone receiving better medical care, and I hate it that low income people can't afford to see the doctor when they need to, but I don't think that making everyone get insurance will pay for health care for the ones who can't afford it. I mean, really, how's that gonna work? And another thing, (I know i'm probably going to piss some people off here, but that is not my intention)....alot of the poverty level people I know don't even try to take care of themselves. They do things that make their health worse. Many of them smoke, do druggs, drink rotgut alcohol on a daily basis, have unprotected sex, are overweight and sedentary....then when they have complications from these habits, complain they can't afford to see a doctor. So I go back to my original statement. I don't know what to think
If it were up to me I would make it so that medical care was not so expensive. Why should a surgeon make, say $10,000 for a few hours work and a hospital make $20,000 for a 2-day stay? (these are estimates). My last emergency room bill included a $35 charge for two Tylenol #3's!! But to do that, We'd have to make it so medical school wasn't so expensive. In my opinion, doctors, athletes and movie stars make a ridiculous amount of money for what they do. Houses shouldn't cost $250,000, cars shouldn't cost $20,000 to 50,000, gas shouldn't cost over $3 a gallon and bread sure as heck shouldn't cost 2.99 a loaf!! The American people fell asleep at their posts and now the institutions that were created to look after our best interests have grown into monsters and are unstoppable.
In many states those lower income people you mention already have state funded medical care they qualify for. But those "middle/struggling tax paying class" are classified as exempt due to their income being slightly higher. What people don't seem to realize about private insurance is that most policies have caps. Working for an healthcare insurance provider I can assure you families who thought they were sufficiently covered, in a major medical crisis found out otherwise and despite the premiums they paid for years, they ended up having to sell their homes and struggle the rest of their lives financially. People don't think it can happen to them but reality tells a different story.
I really don't like the force part. If I decide not to have insurance it should be my problem. Forcing everyone to have insurance or making them pay a fine if they don't really seems like it should be unconstitutional, but you can't get the Supreme Court to do anything right I guess.
As for the rest of it all I see is higher taxes. Small business seem to get hit with the worst of it, so now there goes money my boss could be paying me that he has to pay to the gov't. I'm tired to shelling out 25% of my check to help lazy, broke people and pay retarded gov't employee's with over the top insurance and pension plans. Then pay more property taxes to a FUBAR's school system.....
Not from America but I think forcing people to take our health insurance is a good idea from the US Government. If you drum this policy into young people especially those who are working, when they are older and need to access health facilities, it would make life easier for them if they had insurance to being with. I highly recommend the US government to implement a tax policy where people who do take our health insurance are given a lower tax rate. Let say, if someone is working and takes out health insurance, their tax rebate at the end of a financial year should be higher than those who have no health insurance.
Yes. That's what worries me. In my experience, if something sounds too good to be true, it usually is. I just worry that "the bleating sheep" of this country have focused on the benefits of the program and not even considered the things that aren't so kosher. I mean, how would you feel if I needed a new car, and the government said, OK, everybody who can afford it will be required to buy a new car, except for the ones who can't afford it. We'll provide new cars to those who can't afford one using the profits from those who we force to buy one. Nice for me, but why should you have to buy your car and mine?
Like I said. I don't know what the answer is for this dilemna, but I see us getting closer to being a police state every day. First they forced us to wear seat belts or pay a fine, then it was helmets or pay a fine, now its health insurance or pay a fine. Whats next? Forcing everyone to have homeowners/renters insurance? Hurricane insurance in the mid-states "just in case"? Insurance on our teenagers in case they ever break someone's window or T.P. a house? I just wonder where it will all end? America was built on the principle of "land of the free" but all I see is the shackles getting tighter
BREAKING: Insurance premiums = Tax .....cars/home, etc ...are they Next ? Coming after you ? ....property siezures to rise ? AYTHING you pay insurance on now, Next ? What's there to Stop them ? What a comforting future us young people ! Tune in tv..he can't hide his celebration/bragging about this new law.....Remember he argued 'It is NOT a Tax' ! (ck it) but yet, that's exactly the argument the Gov't changed to mid-stream in their SCOTUS case ! ck it.....Gov't just made bigger/more intrusive & Congrats, it'll soon hit your home or shelter....prepare your wallet...even the POOR....
What are your thoughts on the US government making people get health insurance or face penalties?
It's not a novel idea ...Medicare Part D is a requirement for seniors with out prescription drug coverage and you face penalties for not signing up. And that's been around and passed by the Government long before Obama. As I see it, the government has been spending my tax dollars and earmarks for things I neither agree with nor would ever want my monies going towards. At least this tax focuses on our own people and their well being ......for a change.
Also joejoe, I know people with COPD, chronic asthma and bronchitis who absolutely can't wait for Obamacare to start because right now they can't afford health care, but they either walk to the store or bum a ride from me everyday for a pack of cigarettes, a pepsi and cat food. Which, BTW, their cats won't eat the cheap cat food so they have to buy the .50 cent cans. 30 packs of cigs at $4 a pk is $120 a month and cat food at 50 cents a can, 4 cans a day for 30 days is $60, for a total of $180 a month they could be spending on insurance premiums
I agree filletofspam and although most only focus on the profits of insurance companies. That profit margin is not solely theirs. Pharmaceutical companies, Medical device manufacturers, Medical Labs and the medical industry as a whole acquire much higher profit margins then the insurance companies who have to pay them whatever dollar amount they choose to charge. I see The Affordable Care Act as the first step toward addressing their skyrocketing profitiering down the road.
Mixed feelings. What we really should have is single payer government health care like most other 1st world countries have. Getting this would be almost impossible with the number of legislators beholding to the insurance industry. The Affordable Care Act is probably the best way to extend healthcare coverage to millions of more Americans without adversely impacting insurance company profits.
Regardless, if you're Pro-Choice or Pro-Life, as a taxpayer you are now Forced to fund Pro-Choice....The 'Stolen Valor Act' was also struck down today..Now ok to LIE about medals..ck it...Lesson: 'Elections matter'...as Dr King said 'should be judged by the content of their Character' NOT 'the Color of their Skin'...ck it...
Regardless, if you're Pro-Choice or Pro-Life, as a taxpayer you are now Forced to fund Pro-Choice....The 'Stolen Valor Act' was also struck down today..Now ok to LIE about medals..ck it...Lesson: 'Elections matter'...as Dr King said 'should be judged by the content of their Character' NOT 'the Color of their Skin'...ck it...
Regardless of values/religion you are now Forced to fund ALL actions of Planned Parenthood ie:ending life...The 'Stolen Valor Act' was also struck down today..Ok to LIE about medals, ck it....Lessons: Elections matter..as Dr King said 'Content of their Character' NOT 'Color of their Skin'..ck it...
My opinion, the government over-reaching....remember when BHO said 'not one dime more' will be added by obamacare (ck it).....WATCH !! .....AMERICAN'S lost today.....good luck with that Tax bill and Insurance premiums......another 'Freedom - the 'right to choose' on a purchase eliminated.....
ok as some of you say its socialism.and trust me i dont like that at all.. but what ABOUT the people who are unable to pay for there surgery??? what did they do wrong.they couldn't work because they were sick and they cant get better because they cant afford it???? how do you fix it?
but when someone doesn't have insurance and they get hurt the hospitals still have to pay to heal them which means people have insurance ending up paying more so its not really your problem because it becomes our problem to
2008 Obama: Health Care Should "Never Be Purchased With Tax Increases On Middle Class Families." http://funadvice.com/r/163hdqh74jf
IRS now obligated/mandated to come after ALL un-insured, regardless of economic status......
Sorry for the 2 entries...the banner above kept telling me rejected....
Just another step toward socialism.
Agreed!
